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onwardsupwards
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« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2008, 07:05:30 AM » |
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Just to clarify JD, I was refering to directional line markers ie arrows, not personal markers ie peg/cookies.
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Do It Right or do it somewhere else
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JD
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« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2008, 10:52:51 AM » |
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Roger.
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
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Drilling holes is just boring.....
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Ian T
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« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2008, 12:21:29 PM » |
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I raised the question of individually vs team line marking as it's a key difference between some Cave training agencies. The benefit of individually marking the line to me, is that it tells all divers in the team that they understand the dive plan, provides a double check of the marker placement, and in an emergency (divers separated ) can indicate the position of the other divers in the team, even when not in visual contact.
The counter argument is that it's slower ( which I don't think it is actually ), and the dive team will remain close together anyway, so one marker is suitable. I have had problems with my buddy not removing his marker ( so I left the jump installed as I thought another team was using our jump ), which was annoying, though wasn't a major problem.
For me, the benefit of all divers marking the line is greater than just one diver in the team marking it.
Ian
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PMH
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« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2008, 01:23:57 PM » |
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Gents,
During the pen course, you will see why we peg as individuals, not as a team, especially on jumps. It is a safety issue, and those who dont fail.
I do not know if GUE, TDI, CDG or anyone else teaches different, but this is one point where the CDAA is 110% right, and any other way is wrong.
Craig,
The thick bungee is the go. Clipped off as far back as possible, but reachable. I clip off to the small D rings on the side of the transpac back bit (have a look, you will get it). When retrieving, if you have a few to collect in quick succession, peg them to your chest strap and stow them later.
JD
correct!!!!! maybe one day I will get the chance to dive with JD in Tank |
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onwardsupwards
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« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2008, 05:29:18 PM » |
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Ian, are you talking about direction arrows or cookies?
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Do It Right or do it somewhere else
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JD
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« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2008, 08:54:21 PM » |
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I think IT is talking personal markers. Some people use cookies or arrows, but pegs are quickest and easiest to mark junctions etc.
If each team member uses cookies to mark every jump/intersection, it would take a long time. The reason for not using pegs is they can slide down the line if the line is angled, or be moved along the line by another diver. I think common sense should prevail. In 99% of cases, a peg is sufficient. It is quick (no need to stop) easy to deploy and retrieve (just dont tell the missus how great we are with pegs) and simple. The fact they are cheap and easily available is a bonus. I use good quality pegs, and still have the original ones I stole from the basket with no rust etc. They also reduce the stress on the line at intersections.
I also carry line arrows to mark areas on the line for later exploration (ie an offshoot I want to have a look at), difficult intersections, or places where a line arrow may slide away from the junction. I also use them when I have run out of pegs!
Every diver should have a personal marker at every junction.
JD
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Drilling holes is just boring.....
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Ian T
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« Reply #21 on: July 26, 2008, 05:20:07 PM » |
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JD, you and I both know that when we run out of pegs, the peg holding bungee, wetnotes, anything we have, gets clipped off to use as line markers  |
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JD
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« Reply #22 on: July 26, 2008, 05:23:56 PM » |
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Drilling holes is just boring.....
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Gooey
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« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2008, 03:04:47 PM » |
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do you find that the pegs ever fall off the line??
do they slide up and down the line???
not stirring, just that ive never used pegs and i could imagine theses things happening??
ks
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*******************************************************If you are going to do it, dont do it with HARVS!!! *************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
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PMH
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« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2008, 04:01:35 PM » |
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do you find that the pegs ever fall off the line??
do they slide up and down the line???
not stirring, just that ive never used pegs and i could imagine theses things happening??
ks
nope and nope...but possible I guess.. |
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JD
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« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2008, 06:25:37 PM » |
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do you find that the pegs ever fall off the line??
do they slide up and down the line???
not stirring, just that ive never used pegs and i could imagine theses things happening??
ks
Not usually Rick. Obviously if the line runs up to the junction, there is a chance of the peg sliding down the line, however common sense will prevail. You can either peg so it grips the line (ie put the peg right down to the pivot point, not in a 'hole' of the peg) or use an arrow. Looking at the line placement with determine which method is used. JD |
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Drilling holes is just boring.....
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Gooey
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« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2008, 06:29:37 PM » |
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*******************************************************If you are going to do it, dont do it with HARVS!!! *************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
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JD
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« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2008, 06:48:12 PM » |
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Sure Gooey, you can use cookies. As stated before, they take a lot longer to attach to the line, and in a 3 person team doing a lot of intersections this time can add up. Pegs are quick, simple, easy to deploy (Oh bugger it, I am just repeating myself here. Read the above posts) Believe us, pegs are the go. You dont even slow down. I think cookies (or arrows) would be the only way to go in flow, which is probably why the US guys use them. I can see where pegs have limitations, just not in Tank. Please use cookies if you want, just dont expect me to wait..... JD |
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Drilling holes is just boring.....
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